Jul
22
Thorin's Thoughts – Team Liquid Trample IEM Chicago (CS:GO)



you know this is a look you've got a pretty big pose to watch Victorians YouTube video teamliquid have one I am Chicago in absolutely ridiculous fashion they would have completed the grand slam at this point in time for season two if they hadn't of won in Cologne obviously famously everyone knew Australis wasn't attending but since they already won the Grand Slam at the last event well two events ago because it was blast Elia if you call that an event they now start the next grand slam and guess what they're one event along the way to win in the next grand slam hence why actually for season three the rules got changed where yes you have to win four tournaments are ten but you have to win one of the specific designate like big events you can't win any old events or my joke that I made on Twitter is now teamliquid or even fucking up the Intel Grand Slam for every other team because every other team up there remember that famous story I always cite where when the Grand Slam was announced and at a time of straws like number three or number four Dupree famously said no one's gonna win that million dollars well in theory no one was supposed to do when after there's trials where no one was ever meant to win again except maybe Australis so the idea is if they keep winning the Grand Slam team could somehow now goes on wins a second Grand Slam they're gonna make the rules even harder for season three aren't they they're gonna make it like a pop season for now be even impossible so my joke is like the Reg she'll just have to win all ten events in a row to win the grandstands until I get sick of given the million dollars away but that's just a joke to emphasize the boy how dominantly teamliquid won this event because this is a tournament in which yes you didn't have astral Asst yes he didn't have Navi but you know what you identify telly they are the number two number two three teams in the world so look at this tournament where they played both of those teams they only lost one map in the entire tournament they played ten maps in total and they lost one and that was in their series against g2 the thing that they played in the best-of-five EPL season nine files and won 3-1 against they lost us to opener to g2 obviously a fabulous map for g2 fairly cause series overall as well g2 are their chances over the first two maps so actually the hope I have here is that maybe g2 after seeing that match in the group and then the final EPL hopefully they can actually come on and become the rival two seem liquid nor rival in terms of winning events GT was probably not going to do that but just directly when they play them they can be eating the compulsion that can take them to the limit because every great team needs one in order to keep the casual fans inside otherwise you get what happened with the Australis cars last year where even though watching them as an aficionado of CS is amazing and there are feats a accomplishing are incredible they still having great matches that they win cause not enough opponents can beat them and really challenge them casual fans are gonna call it boring because to them that's boring there's not enough excitement there's not enough diversity of winners etcetera these are things that casual fans care about so just as when SK was non born in 2017 he had the g2 line that could stop them there well obviously that GT won't was still technically like an elite or boardroom and elite team who won tournaments themselves this Gesu lion doesn't look like that so the contrast I would give would be when fnatic was number one and they had their era the team actually that most commonly would beat them aside from TSM offers who's their direct rival and could win events they had a kind of a kryptonite who were a lower level team and were cattle in events it was obviously existence is Titan where it was when he had Ken yes and clearly they were beating them outright when he lost Kelly and they were London Power Team but then Kenny s was the best player in the whole world at the time the best player maybe we'd ever seen they could beat them they could still beat them on many occasions and indeed did and took them close many many times so I think it would be cool of G to someone develops into that type of the squad against them so Tim I could play 10 maps at the tournament they won nine of them of the nine maps four of them were absolute stomps three of them were convincing wins two of them were course wins and one was the one that they lost so that was the 10 maps they easily beat the new NV lineup not a particularly good team doesn't really matter they crushed vitality who remember are the number two team in the world and the context there is not only did they crush them scoreboard doesn't serve you 1611 69 but in the context that laws are vital east to best maps that were being played in that to zero that is a crushing actually that is convincing because you know what when you play your two best maps in the series all over and over again as vitality has done you're supposed to sometimes win one of those series cuz they're your best maps as well maybe you have a great day and you win that time especially one of them is the stew you're supposed to win it eventually it's actually one of the lower rated Winry it maps to team look good even though they're godlike on it because it's such a variable map except apparently when similar players vitality on this map so you look at it like I say in theory vital he's supposed to sometimes get a win here like they did the first time they play it but you know what that theory doesn't always work out because that's exactly the scenario that last year's been born in number two were my team liquor was number two Australia's number one the problem was a stars had a slightly larger map pool an air map pool completely covered team liquids map pool and as a result Team Liquid ended up losing all those matches the occasion you won a map but that's it otherwise they just lost all those matches and it could go the other way you could also lose them all because you're also getting your best maps but they're also your opponent's first maps and they're a better team than you so I kind of feel like there's a similar scenario and that vitality is gonna end up being like the team liquid to Australis cuz yeah they won the first meeting that they had but look where that meeting was it was at CS summit well guess what when you're at sea s summit it's more of a I know it's not just in that house anymore but it is more of a chill event it's not a massive stage environments not a prestigious tournament it's not something that like you're gonna worry about for the rest of your career and since it was the first time the two teams have played on land my theory actually is that when you play someone like a zero or simple when he's in Navi on the corners and mouse sports the first time you play a super god-like hard to carry soul or carry player like that I think it takes a little bit of time to feel that out to know where his tendencies are whereas sweet spots are what the kind of areas you can pressure em are and kind of sense how to play against him and sometimes away from him famously when Nico was in Mouse sports no one Maps cache is a good example where you can rotate quickly as team between the sites where when people found out what site Nico played a CT they would sometimes just walked it to the other site say fuck it the other players are at the other site and if they could would have won before tip your hat to him so when simples being in Navi I know some of the players behind the scenes think even Laurier's on unbelievably god-like they think you can kind of sense where he's gonna be on the map and you can't stop him but you can at least kind of know where to follow the others or where to attack them and they think that's part of why you can beat Navi you if you can't directly beat simple heads ahead so I'm looking for that because obviously if I tell it is the second best team in the world they should be contending with teamwork and finish titles but you know what at the moment this matchup isn't good for them they can't do shit against the firepower liquid because they've already got zero on their team at the moment then you've got the whole angle of the map pool they're completely covered by the team liquid guys at the moment stuff on there then I didn't that seem wicked wins all the force I seemingly when tons of clutches it feels unfair to play against and I can I think I'd feel for the guys from vitality intents but I'm sorry you're just playing like team recorded last year and then era of an unbelievably good counter-strike team the only event as I said that they beat Team Rocket it was a smaller event without the big stage cell and remember the two revelations for vitality is II was an individual player unbelievably good better than he should be at this point and Alex is an in-game leader also better than he should be as far as an in-game leader saw an experience they haven't played many huge stage set up finals so when he put them in these scenarios in big playoff matches they aren't always going to be able to come up with the goods and they shouldn't be expected to that's unreasonable it reminds me of when famously all the fans who here it's simple especially all the Brazilian fans flame them after that ESL one cologne 2016 final were a guy who I think at the time was 17 years old card carried in na team to a major file never happened before and then got dumped Cinderella fun they're like how could it be that good if he lost in the file it's like mother fucker is he sponsors win everything will just do it all like what is this shit like he's not literally Jesus you always a human being right like the expectations can be ridiculous you've got to put it in context sometimes so then you get to the final what should have been the most challenging match right accept and have told people this before told her on many occasions this entity wants normal the fucking part of this team liquid team because this ends team it isn't the ansan team liquid from the measurement a lot has changed since then and it's all shifted heavily in the favorite team liquid this was the most dominant best-of-five maybe they don't stumble in final and playing best of three one sort of is easier to dominate the most dominant best of five found ever seen in csgo unbelievable especially at the top level number one and number three teams in the world playing to events is top four maps by Winry over the last six months with the first two maps they played it was obviously nuke and overpass and they couldn't get a single map in the whole series they couldn't win either of these maps in fact on those two maps two of their top four maps by Winry on LAN they only managed to get five rounds total across both maps Inferno was close but didn't matter in the end I mean and even then to get it close for winning clutches took winning miracle entries pistol rounds and that was just to give them a chance which they in the end couldn't convert the problem is ence is a very good couch strike team but first of all i think personally they've been hit by the old nerve secondly i think generally they had a firepower issue anyway and seems like teamliquid who are orden believe the skilled moving them or skilled fired my lap to ever play counter-strike so the problem is and so ready has firepower issues but in a different way to vitality because vitality has the big gun they have zero who could be the best player of the whole serve although he hasn't done yet against team liquid ends they have smaller star in sir games not going to be like 0 but the problem is the lineup intense in terms of man-for-man supposed to be more skilled with vitality but at the moment they're not all in that good form like aerial completely disappeared ever since he won not blast madrid MVP which puts huge fresh on circuit after frag and he's also a very young guy and he isn't zero he isn't simple it's unreasonable to expect them to be at that simple leak or zero level like he's just a very good young players developing and might be couple years from being one of those superstar names me isn't now he's not a prodigy in the same way then you have the org nerf i think if you look at the CT sides it hurt them there was so good at positioning they could use their team player to beat teams that had better gun skills in them because the old was so powerful especially stationary just spraying into a certain spots they had the lords of good to man setups this does not work with an m4 you cx-7 just doesn't have the same kind of impact that he did when he had an org whereas he might get those two kills with a you know fucking fadeaway spray with the AAG he's gonna get the first kill them for them probably just died on the second one when the guy runs out with an air case or it's understandable why they would be hurt skill wise they already slightly like for a bit of skill anywhere so for me the awkward nerf hurt two teams the moss because two teams with a similar set of strengths and it was tense and it was renegades now they're both less skilled than the other elite teams in the world they both have good team player they both have strong tactics the problem is the skill differentials the problem and the old was making up for that it's one of the reasons why I'm kind of torn on whether the organ of was right I'd have preferred that you made it more expensive and therefore made managing your economy a premium if you were one of those teams I think that would be fairer personally maybe do something different with the win-loss bonus to err to edge things out in that respect and also you have to add in ants is another team that has their whole motherfucking Matt Palmer cover by team liquid especially goes in their case and his best map is trade which is team liquids perma ban and Team Liquid not only is willing to play vertical they've won all five times they've played it so ends has to perma ban that still and can't float it and ban something like overpass or something along those lines that they don't wanna have to play against the team look guys I know everyone before when I tweeted before the final that because of these factors team LaHood would be a favor on every map I had Lourdes people tell me no what about new Answers a favor Arnie looked on a nine-game winning streak seven of those nine games were before the org nerf it's a CT sided map they relied on some of those CT rounds with the org to be able to win those nine games so as a result I didn't expect that at all you've got to put those records in context and look at what happened between those games not just look at the nine games as other all uniform and exactly the same and identical they aren't so the problem is ants is still a top team but I personally think with what I've seen the last couple of tournaments that came last place in Cologne obviously I actually think they're gonna drop off a bit and just be a top five team they could still occasionally possibly win a tournament they didn't win that we chose before anywhere I don't think there'll be an event winner from here on out I think they'll just make some nice semies occasional final there'll be a solid team I'll cheer for him I like watching him play like they were very entertaining stellar player I think he's brilliant the story of Alexi be of sir gear valo coming home of people developing who wouldn't all buddies before problems they're just not the best team and they don't want prime to be and the team that is number one right now seriously covers them and then who's number two vitality who's gotten in that ass against thence the last couple of times saw ants in a tough spot at number three right now Australia's probably getting stronger some other teams gonna change lineups Navi maybe gonna get better I see them kind of dropping off to number five in the next few months now Team Liquid as a team let's just talk about these motherfuckers I'm not I'm gonna be making all these videos well let's do it shall we okay as a team in terms of skill very are the more skill that I've ever seen play csgo in terms of active skill actually in the server what they can do it's unbelievable levels of fragging it's unfair it should feel unfair that every member of the team can have these top frag games can a big eared er can have impact on the match and at the same time that's the key thing I've like three players golf at once reminds me of astrologer I think the style along with the skill is elevating the fracking the clutch is fucking bonkers another thing that reminds me of last year's Australis is they are the only team aside from that Australis team i've ever seen where it doesn't matter what two players are left in a 2 v 3 or 2 V 45 it feels possible now I stir joke when they had the bad G to line up last year if that was fuckin Smith's and body with him two alive in a few before I knew the run was over already with this team even picked the players who were on paper the worst players that would be what nitrile Stevie to care put Nigel suit you can achieve before I've seen him winning before and it feels possible don't was winded fucking clutches boy he's a big-time player so then you go to the role versatility also seems absolutely unfair like the amount of bullshit rounds nitrile gets with an off where he either kills three or four people who push him as though he was fuckin zero or he just frags out and wins the clutch and a 1v2 one we see and he's supposed to be the in-game leader he's also be the worst player of the team and he's doing that shit and beacon entry annie cannot like fucking hell the role diversity is just unfair so the team of could error it was already started but it continues unabated now one another event I think there's now one something like five events in a row let me think cuz CS summit was on they didn't have obviously won five Grand Slam events for that's different than when the blast Elliott Sara but for me don't worry about people who were slaughter come on board I can tell you how heroes work that people who are fans of the other teams especially the last team that was on top always are the ones most resistant what happens is over time they're all one offered by the accomplishments more wins more victories more dominance more titles a major eventually they'll all be won over and by the way when they're all won over they'll all retcon history and deny they ever said the teamwork the best that they wouldn't want they'll make it seem like it was as as much of a factor as the Sun rising and saying that hey everyone knew that right that's why I always joke people tell me in the moment now I don't know through my car I strike and then when they explain their thoughts half of the things they explain the principles they stay in the concepts the outliner my motherfucking concepts and paradigm of thinking about counter-strike that I invented over the last 19 years like it's hilarious how people will do that right use my own points against me then make out like babe the more or they you understood them yeah you want some tact all do you motherfucker sit the fuck down so the era continues and quite frankly what I love now is just like astralis in the second half of last year now is the phase where you just make all the excuses go away one by one until how can they even argue against you so if the old was still powerful people would have said ashes because they are powerful well guess what the old fall off team records even better than they were when the old was strong then they could see it ah but what about this one team that beat you so vitality had beaten them before cologne right yeah they've beaten vitality the next two times after that including a best-of-five this is ridiculous all the teams were up these tournaments Australis was at the last two events recently that liquid was up all he played them once couldn't even stop them couldn't get to the final once and some vitality were a whole bunch of these events and they're the number three number two teams in the world in terms of ranking the key thing for me Team Liquid another crazy thing like Australis last year is they have no rivals nobody can beat them consistently or even look like they should beat them and it's why the GT angle is when I play it up and I'm kind of hopefully looking towards but I don't necessarily expect because obviously not actually overall that good a team you can't complain about like like teams haven't down roster moves like they tried to blast you with the straws because guess what Strassen was dominant for so long and then she ever wanted one of us to move what's the same with this team while they've been went round every motherfuckers doing roster move hasn't stopped them plenty of happened so they're going not only for a great era for the major they're going for the best year ever as well they've been in every final except the major biscuit beans of like what 9 or 10 finals is unbelievable shit right now they're on a streak of nine finals in a row which is second only to the ni P which began CS score with like 15 files are on some of those well bombers events compared to what liquids on this is better than Australis this is better than fnatic this is Bella and SK Lou Brock this is already some epic all-time great shit this team liquid liner right now I'll say this an obviously don't go crazy but in some tragic scenario where they were old was killed in a plane crash tomorrow they don't need to play another map of counter-strike and they would be a top-ten lineup of all-time in csgo probably even top 5 maybe that one's more question because they haven't won a major they haven't even gone deep and a major with this far my lineup so that's why that's one a maybe hold often but they'd already be top 10 with whatever cop the records they're broken and the shit that they're doing right now and the eye test tells you like a motherfucker right then I didn't there Matt poor this team's gonna be dominant for a long time boys because right now they don't play train Superman they play all six other maps and they have a winning record a good winning record on all of them their worst map by winning record is thus to where they is sixty nine point six percent win rate every other map is seventy percent or higher every other map in the fucking pool now yes the eye test tells you is their nuke or infernal that God like the fucking wind Riya tells you they spank that ass they so rarely ever lose series they don't even lose that many maps overall this team is unbelievably good people actually believe it or not until the moment they wouldn't cologne there was a lot of people trying to argue against this team they won't look at the fucking stats I wonder if they were using the eye test properly because this team already was if you watch them play and then you looked at the records in the stats it's screamed dominant team era incoming buckle the fuck down but as usual I have to get there before all you guys so I can tell you all this shit's you can then hear my thoughts eventually they're registered then you can tell me the backyards literals and they were your thoughts right let's let the cycle continue for a 20th year in the raw second week merely 19th I haven't stole my eighteenth and a half or something ridiculous now here's the thing that's actually having six maps with the winner I thought beyond even Australis like astralis at least had some ups that would be cool and close to a 50% win rate or you know they'd lose like two or three in a row on one of them now astronomers could have actually been better than liquid even here because like stars actually could play a cache their permit so they could have flex to all seven there's chose not to get in me – I don't think personally that liquids are gonna play train what's the point especially because vertical is about people aren't playing much but the five times liquids played it then won all five so right now they are so locked in to win that they should in theory win every tournament they attend now there is no reason they shouldn't at this moment and as a result I'll make a whole separate video on this but they are the biggest favorite heading into a major that has ever existed in csgo history now I'll very briefly just say that's because other big favorites always had a loss coming in so the one that didn't was fnatic 26 one six students in a role but if you ever seen my video they weren't all six big events not all them with that busy and then you turned out all of my sudden injury right then you have Australian to major the last lineup right well the first one face it London they just lost DREAM Act Stockholm to fucking North before into series so they weren't as big of favorites Team Liquid is now then he brought it kind of eats here they just lost I have a power masters the theme recorded in the file there this theme is winning everything and is going to come in on something like five events one in a row and like six of the last seven or something mental and then been in every final except the major saw they are insane like no one's a lock to win the edge of because obviously you can just go ahead not win it's a sport that that can happen but they are the closest to a lock you will ever fucking see the only team I'll reference that maybe could be compared it's maybe the envious team before dream up cluj-napoca and if you know the behind-the-scenes of that it was nowhere near like that it's just that the record should there the Lord of finals and with a lot of big titles but even then I don't think as Dominus team liquid is now saw what an unbelievable team a absolute pleasure to watch them player obviously kind of a bit satisfying for me since I did tell you Alicia was the fucking chosen one event here and everyone told me no it's to be to care we know what's two togethers of very good player he's caught being a lot to this team it Alicia's a motherfucker though that guy is the MVP of this tournament if you look at the last few months if you want to say it simples the best for the world or maybe you think it's zero I'll say it pick between the two year which you want one and two I don't mind but number three is Alicia and it that's pretty clear to me what an amazing Fraga what an all-around game and he does more than just the scoreboard he helps the communication he sets the game up right he gets the correct angles holds the game intelligently this is a very very smart player who for me is the best player on this squad and this is a team where twists frags the fuck out as well this video was kindly supported by Alexander Rao net Theo GG Andres snazzle Westerland Dean Tanglers Wendell full blunt smoking anus destroyer Daniel Oliver huorchi Mao Jay Dobbs Kolia G all EG r Tobias furnace corny and a special thanks always goes out to Jerky's minion and wish do you want to suggest a topic or a guest for my content perhaps you'd like to ask me for my monthly video air mayor do you want teasers or who the guests are for my upcoming videos maybe you want to take part in a monthly donate a discussion with me well all of these perks and more are available at the patreon link in the description box below